Apprenticeship - Extending the duration for a restart

You absolutely can record whatever duration you think is correct, as long as you don't artificially extend it to above a year for a brand new start with RPL that would normally take them below a year. I'd definitely just record a realistic PED, which would determine the minimum OTJ for that period. As long as you've got a clear training plan to back it up, that's fine. You don't have to stick to rigid durations, that's a professional judgement.

As always, nice to see a response from you, Ruth!
Our main concern was that if we were to realistically set his PED for the 11months (which he officially has remaining), he will not be able to meet his OTJ. Based on your message, would we then just expect him to go beyond the PED, so he meets the minimum? 

I may have got this a bit muddled. I would never plan for anyone to go past the PED. If the concern is that extending the duration will also increase the minimum OTJ, and you only want to deliver the original OTJ overall, then yes, I understand just recording the remaining 11 months. That would only be the case if they were behind on OTJ before they withdrew though. Are you just trying to catch up? You're right, if they just go past their PED, any duration after the PED doesn't increase OTJ requirement. If you know they're going to take 15 months, but by adding an extra 4 months you're adding an extra load of OTJ when you're already trying to catch up, then I think I'd probably do what you suggest, but you need to consider how that looks in your training plan. Is the idea that you'll plan well over 6 hours a week OTJ on the training plan, then accidentally-on-purpose not deliver that, and deliver the same total amount but over a longer period?

- Yes, when he previously withdrew, he should've been at 15% but was only at 8%, so we do want him to achieve the minimum within this timeframe and catch him up
- I'm unsure if there has been an estimation to confirm how much time he will realistically take to complete, so I'm considering using his current remaining OTJ to calculate the duration
- No plans to under deliver, but rather make sure we are both setting a realistic duration, as well as meeting the minimum OTJ

I can only think of three options really:

- Record a realistic PED that's more than 11 months from restart, and I think* you'll have to deliver more OTJ than originally planned because the total duration is more than the original duration, plus since you're catching up you'd deliver a bit more than 6 hours a week. The training plan would reflect what you actually think is deliverable.

- Record an 11 month duration, which means your original OTJ still stands because the total duration will match the original duration (might go down a little if your original start was when it was still 20% rather than 6 hours a week) but you'll have to genuinely plan more than 6 hours a week to fit in the catch up. The training plan would reflect what you actually think is deliverable.

- Record an 11 month duration, which means your original OTJ still stands because the total duration will match the original duration (might go down a little if your original start was when it was still 20% rather than 6 hours a week) even though you know you can't do enough hours a week to fit it into that duration. Your training plan wouldn't be a true and accurate reflection of what you actually think will happen.

Obviously, I don't recommend the third one.

*This is the bit I am not 100% sure on. If this were an apprentice that had done the first period at a different provider, you would have no responsibility for making sure the total OTJ met 6 hours a week for the total duration, you'd only be responsible for meeting minimum OTJ during the period they're doing with you. If it's still the same provider though, I think you do have a responsibility to do 6 hours a week for every week they're with you, and that minimum is calculated on the sum of both periods. Oddly, my thought is that the Planned OTJ on a restart after a full withdrawal, is only the OTJ you're planning on delivering in that second period (not the same with a restart after a break). That's not clear in the rules and I think other people have a different opinion.

I think my interpretation of the guidance, as well as your advice, is that given he did not meet his minimum OTJ prior to withdrawal, he would still be expected to meet that, in proportion to the duration and working hours. Therefore we will realistically determine how many hours of OTJ he can complete per week, and calculate his duration accordingly. If we were to only set it to the remaining duration, we would be asking too much of the employer and the apprentice, which would set him up to go passed his planned end date

Atleast with this, he could have a realistic timeframe, as well as the choice to complete earlier

Thanks again for your efforts on this!

I'm not sure I'm fully right, it's a really messy scenario 🙁 Sometimes it good to chat it through, even if you come to different conclusions!