Apprentice changes employer before taking EPA

If an apprentice changes employer after the programme learning is completed but prior to EPA, must that new employer be in support of the apprenticeship and therefore take on the remaining EPA cost?

Yes

If so, how do we record this on the ILR as there wouldn't be a training price left only assessment price. Do we still need both TNP 3 and 4? 

The ESFA will have held back 20% of whatever the total negotiated price was, payable to you upon completion. TNP4 will be whatever the EPA costs, TNP3 will be whatever remains. 

e.g. if the original total negotiated price was 10,000, then 2,000 will still be 'available'. If your EPA costs 500, this will be TNP4, leaving 1500 for TNP3.

Thanks, Ben. That is really useful!

Hello

Sorry for jumping onto this post but i have a little extension to the question.  What would the process be if the planned end date was already exceeded (Out of Funding in old money)

Learner on DAS and ILR is Sept 20 to Sep 22 Changed Employer in November 22 with EPA expected Jan 23.  As above only the 20% completion left.  But if the 1st Emp Stops in Nov would there be an issue starting the new one in November?

Thanks

 But if the 1st Emp Stops in Nov would there be an issue starting the new one in November?

No, no issue. The stop date for employer 1 and start date for employer 2 should reflect the same month in order for it to not generate a DLOCK10. This guidance explains - Stop dates to use following a change of employer where the gap in employment is 30 days or less – Apprenticeship Service Support (education.gov.uk)

I know in your example the learner stopped and started within the same calendar month, unlike in the guidance when it was across 2 calendar months, but the principle remains the same. The Apprenticeship Service defaults to the 1st of the month, but Employer 2s first payment would be calculated based on the date on your ILR, so they wouldn't be charged for the first part of November. Similarly, Employer 1 would not be liable for the first 'x' number of days within November because, per the Technical Funding specification, the ESFA do not calculate partial funding for an incomplete month:

45. If the apprentice leaves early, for example, they withdraw from the programme, the monthly instalments stop. We will not calculate a monthly instalment for the final month if the apprentice withdraws before the last day of the month in which the learning stops.

I know the learner did not technically "withdraw" in the classic sense, but this is how they've explained it to me in the past

Thanks Ben

So we could/would need a new planned end date on DAS or would it default to original planned and stay Out of Funded with new employer?

The expected end date on DAS should be inclusive of the EPA period, so if you're saying this is Jan 2023, then that would be the date you'd use. Learning end dates – Apprenticeship Service Support (education.gov.uk)

The employer (or the training provider on their behalf) only needs to enter the projected finish date for the whole apprenticeship in the apprenticeship service. This includes the end-point assessment period.

You don't get data locks for planned end dates being different, which you might see a blessing or a curse!