Tracey Richardson
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Tracey Richardson commented,
Steve Hewitt, in such circumstances, would this still generate the completion payments, due to the fact the learner has completed their EPA? The reason I ask is that we have a learner (16-18) that has completed his EPA, but keeps failing his maths L2. I have tried to seek clarity from DfE helpdesk, but they are still 'working on it', as the Funding rules don't seem that clear tbh. The EPA plan for that qual for the level 2 just states that they must have 'achieved English and mathematics qualifications in line with the apprenticeship funding rules', and funding rules for 23-24 seem to suggest that they need to achieve at level 2, but in para 42, also states, about where for Level 2 standards that do not require a Level 2 FS for the apprenticeship etc. as the EPA plan is rather vague on this point we're not sure where we stand, but surely if the apprentice has to have their level 2 iaw funding rules, then should the EPAO have accepted an attempt in the first place? We're reluctant to submit the ILR data until we get confirmation on this point as we don't want to fall foul of missing out on the completion payments.
Steve Hewitt, in such circumstances, would this still generate the completion payments, due to the fact the learner has completed their EPA? The reason I ask is that we have a learner (16-18) that ...
Tracey Richardson commented,
Chloe Thanks for the confirmation. That was what we thought, but then started to doubt ourselves. We are trying to find how we 'create' a new learning aim for the FS, for them to continue, but failing that it might be a case of closing the ILR with the 'fail' showing on the record for maths, and then when they do resit and pass, contacting the AO to upload to get the recognition of the pass on their PLR.
Chloe Thanks for the confirmation. That was what we thought, but then started to doubt ourselves. We are trying to find how we 'create' a new learning aim for the FS, for them to continue, but fail...
Tracey Richardson commented,
Chloe the Skills England website just states the must have 'achieved English and mathematics qualifications in line with the apprenticeship funding rules', but the Gateway requirements allow for the EPA to be sat providing the apprentice has 'attempted' their Functional Skills, and not when they have passed them, hence why we are in the position we're at. We don't want to effectively 'close' their ILR's until we're certain that this 'failed' attempt won't stop us getting the completion monies; especially as they both want to resit their maths eventually after they've had a bit of further training on their weak areas.
Chloe the Skills England website just states the must have 'achieved English and mathematics qualifications in line with the apprenticeship funding rules', but the Gateway requirements allow for th...
Tracey Richardson commented,
Emma Wilmington, having just contacted LRS regarding an issue where we have had a lad completing his FS prior to joining us on an apprenticeship, and as the FS results weren't showing on his PLR due to it being taken outside of being recorded on an ILR, they said to contact the AO for the FS and give them the ULN for the learner and ask them to upload the achievement that way. It may be another way of still being to show the achievement after the event.
Emma Wilmington, having just contacted LRS regarding an issue where we have had a lad completing his FS prior to joining us on an apprenticeship, and as the FS results weren't showing on his PLR du...
Tracey Richardson commented,
Ruth Canham-James you always seem to be the one who provides me with the most logical and appropriate advice when I pose these questions, so hence why I regard you as my guru!! 😁 As we're only a small ITP, we don't have a full MI system, but the company we use for our ILR's might be able to assist with a bit of luck.
Ruth Canham-James you always seem to be the one who provides me with the most logical and appropriate advice when I pose these questions, so hence why I regard you as my guru!! 😁 As we're only a sm...
Tracey Richardson commented,
According to the Guidance that I came across the other day, this states the following: If a learner undertakes a learning aim, finishes learning, takes the final assessment and fails, then this aim should be closed and recorded as ‘not achieved’ (Outcome code 3). Where this learner is then identified as needing further support or additional learning in order to pass the assessment, then a new learning aim should be recorded as a restart with a Funding adjustment for prior learning to account for the new learning required to pass the resit. You must not amend the original, closed learning aim. Where no further learning is required and the learner is only resitting the assessment or exam, then this is not funded and a new aim must not be recorded. https://guidance.submit-learner-data.service.gov.uk/provider-support-manual/article/recording-learner-changes-in-the-ilr As we are looking at providing some additional support for our learners to assist them to pass, but we don't have any additional funding to be drawn down, I am assuming that we restart this aim, but use the code to state it won't be funded, but should allow us to carry out the training and allow them to resit their exams. Ruth Canham-James you always seem to be a guru on these sort of things, would you be able to advise please?
According to the Guidance that I came across the other day, this states the following: If a learner undertakes a learning aim, finishes learning, takes the final assessment and fails, then this ai...
Tracey Richardson commented,
Emma Wilmington, we are in the same position at present, where we have two learners that failed their maths, but have since completed and passed their EPA, but as soon as I try to record this in the ILR (especially as it is R14), it will close the record down for good as far as I am aware. The only way we can see to 'wrap things up' on our side is the record the fail, but that will only allow for the release of the completion payments, but when it comes down to being able to record a Pass for their maths when they do complete, I'm unsure as if you were to go back into their original record to change the dates, for the Pass, that date would then impact the 'Contract Applies to' date, so wouldn't be possible to save it.
Emma Wilmington, we are in the same position at present, where we have two learners that failed their maths, but have since completed and passed their EPA, but as soon as I try to record this in th...
Tracey Richardson commented,
Steve Hewitt TBH that was my original thought as the EPA result and ZPROG effectively equate to the same
Steve Hewitt TBH that was my original thought as the EPA result and ZPROG effectively equate to the same
Tracey Richardson commented,
Ruth Canham-James thank you for that. I agree that it was a bizarre thing for Helpdesk to state, when as stated, they are faults created this open year, so seemed bizarre that we couldn't correct them. Fantastic, I will get these changed prior to filing my R14 return!
Ruth Canham-James thank you for that. I agree that it was a bizarre thing for Helpdesk to state, when as stated, they are faults created this open year, so seemed bizarre that we couldn't correct t...
Tracey Richardson commented,
Ruth Canham-James Thanks again. I have let my boss know so we can check the dates to make sure it is over the 30 days and apply a break and restart as you have suggested. Trying to make sure all my data is clear for the R14 and as he has recently changed employer, this came up!
Ruth Canham-James Thanks again. I have let my boss know so we can check the dates to make sure it is over the 30 days and apply a break and restart as you have suggested. Trying to make sure all my...